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Poster: gratefuldiver Date: Apr 13, 2010 10:39pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Road Trip Blues

I'm likely 2 years late with this question, but I couldn't find anything in the forum history that satisfactorily answers my question and I tend to live in the past. IA and GDP don't appear to have any issues with allowing streaming-only out-takes from Dick's Picks CDs. Beautiful SBDs are available on IA to patch missing songs from Vols 1, 3, and 10, for example. Many of the shows used for "Europe 72" are available on IA without omissions. For a few days/hours, Sir Charlie Miller even treated us to songs from April 27, 28, and 29, 1971, from "Ladies and Gentlemen...".

Contrarily, if only a couple songs from a show wind up on a Road Trips CD, the entire show is censored. Case in point, Road Trips Vol 1 No 2 has 4 songs from 10/11/77. (Respectfully, another handful are 'hidden' tracks on DP 29 but this is irrelevant.) The outtakes are not available on IA in any form. I recently had the opportunity to hear a SBD of the whole 10/11 show. To this 1977 fanatic, as a whole, 10/11/77 is up there with Buffalo, the Fox (19th), the Mosque, Boston, Cornell, and May 1 at the Palladium. There isn't a single song this night that doesn't have something very special about it. Sure, we can debate the merit of this show, but the fact remains that the Road Trips series takes more tracks out of circulation than it makes available to the public. Have the GD IA faithful tried petitioning IA/Rhino/GDP to change this practice? Is there anything that we can do??? I'd willingly purchase any Road Trip CD if I knew that I could complete the show with, say, a Charlie Miller SBD of the missing tracks. Instead, I'll boycott buying a single Road Trips CD and instead find an alternative source of the full concert until Rhino/GDP changes their ways. After hearing the entire 10/11 show, I can't help but imagine how 10/14 (or 10/16) sounds in its entirety. And they are next on my wish list for trading.

The whole is much more than the sum of its parts.

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Poster: micah6vs8 Date: Apr 13, 2010 11:45pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Road Trip Blues

This stuff makes me go bs on a really good day. I used to almost feel proud to do business w/ gd. And did so for a long time. No more. For the many reasons stated by,well,so many, for so long. When road trips sells on amazon ,just released Austin/TCU for $55 ,(New!)Why? I mean why fuck so hard against the people that have put in ten, twenty, forty years of love, time and treasure (gotta make that quota with the hard short sell. Buy quick or you lose that bonus CD) AND WE STILL come back for more. They are teaching the viral marketing concept in business schools now based on marketing techniques used by gd in the past. But what of the present. Any business that would conduct itself such as gd does now would be OOB real quick. I am not at all regretting the ride, just so sad to see an important part thrown away so needlessly and carelessly. The Board of Directors needs to think about what kind of business model students in the future may study regarding the foolish decline of a money printing enterprise. And by the way, it pisses me off to no extent that the last really good show I saw (9-19-90) is now hacked apart and will not be released as a whole. And I lost my masters about a year ago . GRRRRRR

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Poster: gratefuldiver Date: Apr 14, 2010 12:38am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Road Trip Blues

I hear you loud and clear. But you are confirming my hypothesis: *we* are GDP's core market and GDP is alienating us. It's a testament to how great the music is that there is a new generation of heads who were in elementary school when Jerry passed and were in diapers when the band played their last decent show. I see them at DSO shows and it's inspiring. But they aren't the population that Road Trips should be marketing. Without stereotyping too much, they generally don't have the collecting jones that older heads have and they don't have the disposable income. You're a business scholar...how does one explain to an impersonal corporation that its business model is f*cked! I'm not just ranting here...I'm trying to find a win-win. GDP makes more $ and we get full, unedited concert recordings...starting with all of 1977 :-)

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Poster: cousinkix1953 Date: Apr 14, 2010 3:41am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Road Trip Blues

GDM / RHINO ain't even the best buy these days. AMAZON.com is usually cheaper. One place was selling the new CD/DVD Philly 7-7-89 show for a measley $28.50

I'm not buying those Road Trips compilations either. The bonus disks find their way to a certain Torrent site, when they run out. Somebody uploaded a whole shitload of them from from several releases, which aren't sold any more...

This post was modified by cousinkix1953 on 2010-04-14 10:41:45

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Poster: tigerbolt Date: Apr 14, 2010 4:33pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Road Trip Blues

GDP is no longer has been for a few years now.
http://rhinomedia.com/rzine/pressrelease.lasso?PRID=417

all these shows circulate at your local torrent sites
and the shows that get cut eventually get circulated
you just got to wait around case in point this show
http://db.etree.org/shninfo_detail.php?shnid=95308
from the Mastering Plant in L.A. as for tracks getting cut
i'm not sure if maybe that's a band member decision,damage
reels or just rhino getting the overhead costs down.the fact
is the dead aren't pink floyd or the beatles who can sell
millions of copies.rhino has to keep their costs down,we are
a small fan base who have most shows anyway in fairly decent
quality.it is what it is,maybe when the lease is up the band
will open up the vaults.

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Poster: micah6vs8 Date: Apr 14, 2010 6:36pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Road Trip Blues

With respect tigerbolt, I strongly disagree. They made a choice. No one forced anyone to sign any contract. The grateful dead are a gold (or silver) mine.A lisence to print money. A five year old could run this company with the principal of treating others as we would want to be. Overhead costs ? Small batch printing ? Can't fulfill the contract because of a terrible business model? No no no. How about someone with juice getting down to the floor with the workers to see how things are working or not in this case, gameplan, then fix the damn thing. This is not rocket science.

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Poster: gratefuldiver Date: Apr 15, 2010 11:47pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Road Trip Blues

micah6vs8, you said all that needs to be said on the subject. Thanks. Kindred spirit for sure. I obviously need to accept the fact that I kept my old Denon tape deck and Maxell XLIIs way too long and started downloading from IA after the gold rush. Considering I'm obsessed with a band that played its last *great* show more than 30 years ago (IMHO), I shouldn't be surprised being behind the technology curve.

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Poster: RBNW....new and improved! Date: Apr 13, 2010 11:35pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Road Trip Blues

....and the rich keep getting richer while the poor are getting poorer....

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Poster: gratefuldiver Date: Apr 14, 2010 12:06am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Road Trip Blues

no one is getting richer if i'm boycotting road trips.

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Poster: Longnstrange Date: Apr 14, 2010 9:10am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Road Trip Blues

By 'boycott' you mean you'll import a copy that one of your friends payed for, yea?

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Poster: gratefuldiver Date: Apr 16, 2010 12:02am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Road Trip Blues

Absolutely not. I have no interest in listening to some COMPILATION of songs that happen to be from shows during the same month. I believe that a Grateful Dead show should be listened to as a show. No "best of", no skipping every Bobby song, etc. These are precious moments of history and deserve to be treated as such. Sure, there are people who prefer a 45-min Best of the Van Morrison to Astral Weeks or those who set their iPods to random rather than listen to OK Computer or Urban Hymns as they were meant to be heard. The liner notes to Lou Reed's New York have a very obvious statement but one that almost predicted the result of MP3 players and iPods. They say something to the effect of 'this album should be treated like a book or a film'. One wouldn't read a novel or watch a DVD skipping from chapter to chapter or scene to scene randomly, omitting some, going backward and forward. Why would one want to listen to some artificial 'concert' taking songs from three shows, putting 2nd set songs in the 1st'set, fusing a Scarlet Begonias from one show to a Fire on the Mountain from another? These musicians called the Grateful Dead are artists! Planned, improvised, or completely f*cked up...whatever came from the stage on any given night should be treated with reverence. To do otherwise is no different from a movie studio completely rewriting and re-shooting the final scene of a film to the writer/director's dismay or a publishing company's editor telling an author that his/her novel needs to be 50 pp shorter to be marketable. Diatribe over, Rhino sucks.